[House Hearing, 119 Congress]
[From the U.S. Government Publishing Office]


                 EXAMINING THE POLICIES AND PRIORITIES
                    OF THE MINE SAFETY AND HEALTH 
                             ADMINISTRATION
=======================================================================

                                HEARING

                               BEFORE THE

                 SUBCOMMITTEE ON WORKFORCE PROTECTIONS

                                 OF THE

                  COMMITTEE ON EDUCATION AND WORKFORCE
                     U.S. HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES

                    ONE HUNDRED NINETEENTH CONGRESS

                             SECOND SESSION

                               __________


            HEARING HELD IN WASHINGTON, DC, JANUARY 22, 2026

                               __________

                           Serial No. 119-43

                               __________

    Printed for the use of the Committee on Education and Workforce
    
[GRAPHIC NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]

        Available via: edworkforce.house.gov or www.govinfo.gov
        
                              __________
                              
                    U.S. GOVERNMENT PUBLISHING OFFICE
64-597 PDF                 WASHINGTON : 2026
=======================================================================
       
                  COMMITTEE ON EDUCATION AND WORKFORCE

                    TIM WALBERG, Michigan, Chairman

JOE WILSON, South Carolina           ROBERT C. ``BOBBY'' SCOTT, 
VIRGINIA FOXX, North Carolina            Virginia,
GLENN THOMPSON, Pennsylvania           Ranking Member
GLENN GROTHMAN, Wisconsin            JOE COURTNEY, Connecticut
ELISE M. STEFANIK, New York          FREDERICA S. WILSON, Florida
RICK W. ALLEN, Georgia               SUZANNE BONAMICI, Oregon
JAMES COMER, Kentucky                MARK TAKANO, California
BURGESS OWENS, Utah                  ALMA S. ADAMS, North Carolina
LISA C. McCLAIN, Michigan            MARK DeSAULNIER, California
MARY E. MILLER, Illinois             DONALD NORCROSS, New Jersey
JULIA LETLOW, Louisiana              LUCY McBATH, Georgia
KEVIN KILEY, California              JAHANA HAYES, Connecticut
MICHAEL A. RULLI, Ohio               ILHAN OMAR, Minnesota
JAMES C. MOYLAN, Guam                HALEY M. STEVENS, Michigan
ROBERT F. ONDER, Jr., Missouri       GREG CASAR, Texas
RYAN MACKENZIE, Pennsylvania         SUMMER L. LEE, Pennsylvania
MICHAEL BAUMGARTNER, Washington      JOHN W. MANNION, New York
MARK HARRIS, North Carolina          ADELITA S. GRIJALVA, Arizona
MARK B. MESSMER, Indiana
RANDY FINE, Florida

                     R.J. Laukitis, Staff Director
              Veronique Pluviose, Minority Staff Director
                                 ------                                

                 SUBCOMMITTEE ON WORKFORCE PROTECTIONS

                 RYAN MACKENZIE, Pennsylvania, Chairman

MARK B. MESSMER, Indiana             ILHAN OMAR, Minnesota,
GLENN GROTHMAN, Wisconsin              Ranking Member
JAMES COMER, Kentucky                HALEY M. STEVENS, Michigan
MARY E. MILLER, Illinois             GREG CASAR, Texas
RANDY FINE, Florida                  MARK TAKANO, California
                         
                         C  O  N  T  E  N  T  S

                              ----------                              
                                                                   Page

Hearing held on January 22, 2026.................................     1

                           OPENING STATEMENTS

    Mackenzie, Hon. Ryan, Chairman, Subcommittee on Workforce 
      Protections................................................     1
        Prepared statement of....................................     3
    Omar, Hon. Ilhan, Ranking Member, Subcommittee on Workforce 
      Protections................................................     3
        Prepared statement of....................................     5

                               WITNESSES

    Palmer, Hon. Wayne, Assistant Secretary of Labor for Mine 
      Safety and Health, Mine Safety and Health Administration...     6
        Prepared statement of....................................     8

                         ADDITIONAL SUBMISSIONS

    Ranking Member Omar:
        Document entitled ``Regulatory Timeline of MSHA Silica 
          Standard''.............................................    25
        Document entitled ``Decades of Expert Recommendations on 
          Respirable Crystalline Silica''........................    27
        Letter dated January 20, 2026, from the National 
          Coalition of Black Lung and Respiratory Disease 
          Clinics, Inc. (NCBLRDC)................................    28
        Letter dated January 17, 2026, from Appalachian Citizens' 
          Law Center, Sam B. Petsonk, Esq., and Appalachian 
          Voices.................................................    31

                        QUESTIONS FOR THE RECORD

    Responses to questions submitted for the record by:
        Mr. Wayne Palmer.........................................    35

 
                 EXAMINING THE POLICIES AND PRIORITIES
              OF THE MINE SAFETY AND HEALTH ADMINISTRATION

                              ----------                              


                       Thursday, January 22, 2026

                  House of Representatives,
             Subcommittee on Workforce Protections,
                      Committee on Education and Workforce,
                                                    Washington, DC.
    The Subcommittee met, pursuant to notice, at 10:16 a.m., in 
Room 2175, Rayburn House Office Building, Washington, DC, Hon. 
Ryan Mackenzie (Chairman of the Subcommittee) presiding.
    Present: Representatives Mackenzie, Messmer, Grothman, 
Fine, Walberg, Omar, and Scott.
    Also present: Representatives Moylan and Baumgartner.
    Staff present: Lauren Blunt, Intern; Vlad Cerga, Director 
of Information Technology; Hope Dennis, Intern; Halle 
Greenbaum, Staff Assistant; Libby Kearns, Press Assistant; 
Katerina Kerska, Legislative Assistant; Trey Kovacs, Director 
of Workforce Policy; Campbell Ladd, Clerk; R.J. Laukitis, Staff 
Director; Danny Marca, Director of Information Technology; Brad 
Mannion, Professional Staff Member; John Martin, Deputy 
Director of Workforce Policy/Counsel; Audra McGeorge, 
Communications Director; Ethan Pann, Deputy Press Secretary and 
Digital Director; Kane Riddell, Staff Assistant; Sara 
Robertson, Press Secretary; Katherine Anne Russo, Director of 
Member Services and Coalitions; Heidi Schneider, Professional 
Staff Member; Austin Small, Intern; Joe Wheeler, Professional 
Staff Member; Thomas White, Deputy Clerk; James Whittaker, 
General Counsel; Ilana Brunner, Minority General Counsel; Micah 
Buchman, Minority Intern; A'Ishah Johnson, Minority Grad 
Intern; Stephanie Lalle, Minority Communications Director; 
Dhrtvan Sherman, Minority Research Assistant; Bob Shull, 
Minority Senior Labor Policy Counsel; Raiyana Malone, Minority 
Press Secretary; Kevin McDermott, Minority Director of Labor 
Policy; Marie McGrew, Minority Press Assistant; Eleazer 
Padilla, Minority Staff Assistant; Veronique Pluviose, Minority 
Staff Director; Banyon Vassar, Minority Director of IT.
    Chairman Mackenzie. Good morning. This Subcommittee on 
Workforce Protections will come to order. I note that a quorum 
is present. Without objection, the Chair is authorized to call 
a recess at any time and for note we will be doing so for House 
voting in just a few minutes here.
    We all share the goal of keeping hard-working Americans 
safe. Today's hearing examines the Federal agency responsible 
for ensuring the safety of our men and women who help power our 
Nation. The Mine Safety and Health Administration, also known 
as MSHA, establishes and enforces safety and health standards 
governing all mines, both above and underground.
    We are joined today by Hon. Wayne Palmer, the Assistant 
Secretary of Labor for Mine Safety and Health at the U.S. 
Department of Labor, who will share with us the Trump 
administration's vision for MSHA. Assistant Secretary Palmer 
was confirmed by the Senate on October 7th, 2025. Prior to his 
appointment, he served as the executive Vice President of the 
Essential Minerals Association.
    He also served in the first Trump administration at MSHA, 
including as principal Deputy Assistant Secretary and for a 
time acting Assistant Secretary. He also served as chief of 
staff to a senator from my home State, Senator Rick Santorum. 
This marks the first time in six and a half years that the 
Assistant Secretary of Labor for MSHA has testified before this 
Committee and I commend the Committee for holding this 
important hearing and welcoming Assistant Secretary Palmer 
today.
    Mining plays a critical role in supporting our economy and 
America's energy independence. As a representative of the great 
Commonwealth of Pennsylvania, which has more than 700 active 
mines, I have seen firsthand how this industry supports jobs, 
families and local economies. Under the Trump administration, 
there is an opportunity for mining to grow and continue 
delivering for communities across the country. Last year, 
President Trump issued several executive orders aimed at 
increasing domestic mineral and coal production.
    As we seek to expand production, our responsibility is 
clear. We must ensure workers' protections keep pace. This is 
where MSHA comes in. MSHA must promote and implement strong and 
effective policies, so that every time and every mine worker 
can finish his or her shift and return home safely to their 
loved ones. While MSHA oversees the health and well-being of 
workers in this unique industry, it also faces the challenge of 
protecting workers from hazards common in other industries such 
as respiratory-related silica issues and hazards that are 
unique to mining such as black lung disease.
    Given his leadership experience at MSHA and his background 
right in the mining industry, Assistant Secretary Palmer is 
well equipped to confront these issues and we thank you for 
joining us here today. Going forward, MSHA must uphold strong 
safety standards while also supporting innovation as 
technologies and operational demands evolve. This can be 
achieved by pairing focused, effective enforcement with a 
strong compliance assistance program that promotes 
collaboration among employers, workers and MSHA.
    By working together, we can develop practical common sense 
policies that prioritize safety and worker well-being. Again, 
Assistant Secretary Palmer, thank you for being here today and 
we look forward to your testimony. With that, I yield to the 
Ranking Member for her opening statement.
    [The opening statement of Chairman Mackenzie follows:]

 Statement of Hon. Ryan Mackenzie, Chairman, Subcommittee on Workforce 
                              Protections

    We all share the goal of keeping hardworking Americans safe. 
Today's hearing examines the federal agency responsible for ensuring 
the safety of the men and women who help to power our nation,
    The Mine Safety and Health Administration (MSHA) establishes and 
enforces safety and health standards governing all mines-both above and 
underground. We are joined today by the Honorable Wayne Palmer, the 
Assistant Secretary of Labor for Mine Safety and Health at the U.S. 
Department of Labor, who will share the Trump administration's vision 
for MSHA.
    Assistant Secretary Palmer was confirmed by the Senate on October 
7, 2025. Prior to his appointment, he served as executive vice 
president of the Essential Minerals Association. He also served in the 
first Trump administration at MSHA, including as Principal Deputy 
Assistant Secretary and, for a time, Acting Assistant Secretary. He 
also served as chief of staff to a Senator from my home state, Senator 
Rick Santorum.
    This marks the first time in six and a half years that the 
Assistant Secretary of Labor for Mine Safety and Health has testified 
before this Committee, and I commend the Committee for holding this 
important hearing and welcoming Assistant Secretary Palmer today.
    Mining plays a critical role in supporting our economy and 
America's energy independence. As a representative of the great 
Commonwealth of Pennsylvania, which has more than 700 active mines, I 
have seen firsthand how this industry supports jobs, families, and 
local economies. Under the Trump administration, there is opportunity 
for mining to grow and continue delivering for communities across the 
country.
    Last year, President Trump issued several executive orders aimed at 
increasing domestic mineral and coal production. As production expands, 
our responsibility is clear: we must ensure worker protections keep 
pace. That is where MSHA comes in. MSHA must promote and implement 
strong and effective policies so that every mine worker can finish his 
or her shift and return home safely to their loved ones.
    While MSHA oversees the health and well-being of workers in this 
unique industry, it also faces the challenge of protecting workers from 
hazards common in other industries--such as respirable silica--and 
hazards that are unique to mining, such as black lung disease. Given 
his leadership experience at MSHA and his background in the mining 
industry, Assistant Secretary Palmer is well-equipped to confront these 
issues.
    Going forward, MSHA must uphold strong safety standards while also 
supporting innovation as technologies and operational demands evolve. 
This can be achieved by pairing focused, effective enforcement with a 
strong compliance assistance program that promotes collaboration among 
employers, workers, and MSHA. By working together, we can develop 
practical, commonsense policies that prioritize safety and worker 
wellbeing.
    Assistant Secretary Palmer, thank you for being here today, I look 
forward to your testimony.
                                 ______
                                 
    Ms. Omar. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Good morning, everyone. 
Thank you so much, Assistant Secretary Palmer, for being here 
today. Since its inception in 1977, the Mine Safety and Health 
Administration, MSHA, has strived to protect American miners 
from occupational hazard and negative health impacts, prevent 
disease through inspection and oversight.
    MHSA sets vital health and safety standards, such as rules 
on dust levels, posting warning signs, and controls for 
explosive hazards. To set those standards, MSHA heavily relies 
on the research capacity of other agencies, such as the 
National Institute of Occupational Safety and Health, which 
identifies hazards and conducts health research.
    MSHA's work is critical in keeping miners healthy and 
alive. Unfortunately, after declining for decades, black lung 
disease is now on the rise. X-ray surveillance data indicates 
that the prevalence of black lung disease has doubled from 2007 
to 2017.
    Nearly one in five long-tenured miners in Appalachia have 
been diagnosed with black lung disease. The most severe form, 
called progressive massive fibrosis, is now at epidemic level. 
PMF or complicated black lung is caused by the inhalation of 
coal and silica dust. In fact, silica dust is 20 times more 
toxic than coal dust alone, and has been identified as one of 
the main causes of the spike in black lung.
    Black lung can be a devastating disease. Miners gradually 
lose the ability to breathe, causing them to wheeze and gasp 
for air. For some with PMF, survival requires lung transplant, 
but even then life expectancy does not usually exceed 5 years. 
Even more troubling, PMF is now afflicting miners at far 
earlier ages, with cases being documented in miners in their 
20's, in their 30's and 40's, and sadly, there is still no cure 
for black lung disease.
    The relationship between silica and black lung disease 
among coal miners is particularly well known, but silica dust 
is a significant threat to workers in metal and non-metal 
mines, which makes up more than 90 percent of active miners in 
the country. These miners also face the risk of chronic lung 
disease and cancer.
    Recognizing this long-standing danger, the Biden 
administration made one of the most significant updates to mine 
safety standards in decades to protect miners from exposure to 
silicon dust. In 2024, the Biden-era Department of Labor issued 
a rule to protect workers from serious health threats by 
lowering the allowable levels of silica exposure in miners, and 
extending operation funded respiratory screening to miners.
    Now the Trump administration is reversing course on this 
progress by refusing to defend this new rule in court. We often 
hear our colleagues on the other side of the aisle accuse 
regulatory agencies in a Democratic administration of what they 
call ``sue and settle.'' Right now, this administration appears 
to be working hand in hand with the mining companies to weaken 
this important silica rule.
    Also of critical concern is MSHA's ability to hold bad 
operators accountable for injuring or killing miners. MSHA now 
has only 654 inspectors. I look forward to hearing more from 
the Assistant Secretary about his plans to restore the agency 
to full capacity. Staffing, ultimately, is the agent's capacity 
to get the job done to protect miners.
    I worry that the current status is not serving miners well. 
In 2025 alone, there was 21 percent increase in miners' 
fatality driven by a 40 percent increase in deaths in metal and 
non-metal mines. Ranking Member Scott and I sent two letters 
earlier last year, inquiring about the extent and impact of 
firing DOL and MSHA. The administration has so far failed to 
provide a substantive response to these letters, leaving 
Congress and the miners who rely on the services of MSHA in the 
dark. By firing staff at MSHA and NIOSH, refusing to enforce 
safety regulations, and closing dozens of MSHA offices, the 
Trump administration is failing to protect the health and 
safety of hard-working miners and sabotaging decades of efforts 
to prevent black lung. As healthcare costs skyrocket, miners 
should not have to worry about workplace exposures forcing them 
into hospitals.
    Assistant Secretary Palmer, I look forward to our 
conversation today, and I hope that we can figure out a way to 
keep miners safe and prevent future tragedies. Thank you 
Chairman, and I yield back.
    [The opening statement of Ranking Member Omar follows:]

Statement of Hon. Ilhan Omar, Ranking Member, Subcommittee on Workforce 
                              Protections

    Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Good morning, everyone. Thank you so much, 
Assistant Secretary Palmer, for being here today.
    Since its inception in 1977, the Mine Safety and Health 
Administration, or MSHA, has strived to protect America's miners from 
occupational hazards and negative health impacts and prevent disasters 
through inspection and oversight. MSHA sets vital health and safety 
standards, such as rules on dust levels, posting warning signs, and 
controls for explosive hazards. To set those standards, MSHA heavily 
relies on the research capacity of other agencies, such as the National 
Institute for Occupational Safety and Health (NIOSH), which identifies 
hazards and conducts health research.
    MSHA's work is critical in keeping miners healthy and alive. 
Unfortunately, after declining for decades, black lung disease is now 
on the rise. X-ray surveillance data indicated that the prevalence of 
black lung disease had doubled from 2007 to 2017. Nearly one in five 
long-tenured miners in Appalachia have been diagnosed with black lung 
disease. The most severe form, called Progressive Massive Fibrosis, is 
now at epidemic levels.
    PMF, or complicated black lung, is caused by the inhalation of coal 
and silica dust. In fact, silica dust is 20 times more toxic than coal 
dust alone and has been identified as one of the main causes of the 
spike in black lung. Black lung can be a devastating disease. Miners 
gradually lose the ability to breathe, causing them to wheeze and gasp 
for air. For some with PMF, survival requires a lung transplant, but 
even then, life expectancy does not usually exceed five years. Even 
more troubling, PMF is now afflicting miners at far earlier ages, with 
cases being documented in miners in their 30s and 40s. Unfortunately, 
there is no cure for black lung disease.
    The relationship between silica and black lung disease among coal 
miners is particularly well known, but silica dust is also a 
significant threat to workers in metal/nonmetal mines, which make up 
more than 90 percent of active mines in the country. These miners also 
face the risk of chronic lung disease and cancer.
    Recognizing this longstanding danger, the Biden Administration made 
one of the most significant updates to mine safety standards in decades 
to protect miners from exposure to silica dust. In 2024, the Biden-era 
Department of Labor issued a rule to protect workers from serious 
health threats by lowering the allowable levels of silica exposure in 
mines and extending operator-funded respiratory screenings to miners.
    Now the Trump Administration is reversing course on this progress 
by refusing to defend this new rule in court. We often hear our 
colleagues on the other side of the aisle accuse regulatory agencies in 
Democratic administrations of what they call ``sue and settle,'' but 
right now this administration appears to be working hand in hand with 
the mining companies to weaken this important silica rule.
    Also, of critical concern is MSHA's ability to hold bad operators 
accountable for injuring or killing miners. MSHA now has only 654 
inspectors. I look forward to hearing more from the Assistant Secretary 
about his plans to restore the agency to full capacity.
    Staffing, ultimately, is the agency's capacity to get its job done 
to protect miners. I worry that the current status is not serving 
miners well. In 2025 alone, there was a 21 percent increase in mine 
fatalities, driven by a 44 percent increase in deaths in metal/nonmetal 
mines.By firing staff at MSHA and NIOSH, refusing to enforce safety 
regulations, and closing dozens of regional MSHA offices, the Trump 
Administration is failing to protect the health and safety of 
hardworking miners and sabotaging decades of efforts to prevent black 
lung.
    As health care costs skyrocket, miners should not have to worry 
about workplace exposures forcing them into the hospital. Assistant 
Secretary Palmer, I look forward to our conversation today, and I hope 
that we can figure out a way to keep miners safe and prevent future 
tragedies.
    Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and I yield back.
                                 ______
                                 
    Chairman Mackenzie. Pursuant to Committee Rule 8(c), all 
members who wish to insert written statements into the record 
may do so by submitting them to the Committee Clerk 
electronically in Microsoft Word format by 5 p.m., 14 days 
after this hearing. Without objection, the hearing record will 
remain open for 14 days to allow such statements and other 
extraneous materials noted during the hearing to be submitted 
for the official hearing record. I note that some of my 
colleagues who are not permanent members of the Subcommittee 
may be waiving on for the purpose of today's hearing.
    Now to our witness introductions. Obviously joined by one 
individual today, who has already been introduced, Mr. Wayne 
Palmer, the Assistant Secretary of MSHA. We want to thank you 
for being here today, and we look forward to hearing your 
testimony. Pursuant to Committee rules, I would ask that you 
limit your oral testimony to 3-minute summary of your written 
statement, which you have provided to all of the Committee 
members.
    As Committee members may have many questions for you, the 
clock will count down from 3 minutes and pursuant to Committee 
Rule 8(d) and Committee practice, however, we will not cut you 
off until you reach the 5-minute mark. I would also like to 
remind you to be aware of your responsibility to provide 
accurate information to the Subcommittee. With that Assistant 
Secretary Palmer, you are recognized for your testimony.

 STATEMENT OF HON. WAYNE PALMER, ASSISTANT SECRETARY OF LABOR 
      FOR MINE SAFETY AND HEALTH, MINE SAFETY AND HEALTH 
                ADMINISTRATION, WASHINGTON, D.C.

    Mr. Palmer. Thank you, and good morning Chairman Mackenzie, 
Ranking Member Omar and members of the Subcommittee. Thank you 
for inviting me to testify here today, and I also want to thank 
Chairman Walberg and Ranking Member Scott for joining this 
hearing.
    It is an honor to appear before this Subcommittee and to 
represent President Trump, Secretary Chavez-DeRemer and the 
Mine Safety and Health Administration. As a descendant of both 
coal and metal/non-metal miners, it is a privilege to serve as 
the 12th Assistant Secretary for MSHA, and I can think of no 
mission more vital than ensuring the day-to-day safety and 
long-term health of our Nation's 325,000 miners.
    Being called to appear this early in my tenure as Assistant 
Secretary, I thought it would be helpful to share with you my 
initial vision for how I believe MSHA should fulfill its 
mission of promoting safe and helpful workplaces for the 
Nation's miners. In accordance with Executive Order 14219, 
which directs agencies to focus limited enforcement resources 
on regulations squarely authorized by statute, MSHA will first 
prioritize statutorily mandated mine inspections along with 
accident investigations and mine rescue operations.
    In enforcing MSHA's statutes and regulations, we will call 
balls and strikes, and when mine operators commit errors, we 
will cite and penalize according to the Mine Act's strict 
liability standard, evenhandedly, without fear or favor. I also 
will seek to modernize the agency in two ways. The first is 
through technological advancements. As Deputy Assistant 
Secretary in the first Trump administration, we launched an 
aerial drone program for inspecting high hazard impoundments 
using 3D imaging, enabling our inspectors to identify 
structural deficiencies in tailings dams from a safer distance.
    We pioneered an artificial intelligence platform capable of 
predicting real world mine safety risks based on decades of 
data. As I sit here today, we are further refining this AI 
platform and will integrate its predictive data into smart 
helmets that we soon will be field testing in mines.
    Second, wherever possible, we will modernize agency 
regulations. During the first Trump administration, for 
example, we updated existing rules to accommodate advancements 
in electronic detonators, which minimize accidental misuse 
during blasting in a mine.
    I take the helm at an especially important dynamic moment 
for America's mining industry as this administration implements 
policies to improve American competitiveness and address 
downstream affordability for consumers of finished goods and 
energy. As you know, we have grown dependent on non-domestic 
mineral supply chains, including from countries hostile to our 
economic and security interests.
    This administration is vigorously pursuing policies aimed 
at reshoring those supply chains. Where the previous 
administration granted fast 41 permitting status to only a 
single new mine project, already during its first year in 
office the Trump administration has granted such status to 14 
additional projects, focused all on critical minerals.
    Where the outgoing administration imposed a moratorium on 
coal lease sales, in service of energy security and 
affordability the Trump administration is moving to increase 
sales. These are just two examples of actions that will lead to 
new mines and increased production at existing mines, with the 
International Energy Agency reporting that strong policy 
support already boosted domestic demand for coal in 2025.
    What does this mean for MSHA as an agency? Well, from a 
safety perspective, when new mines enter their development 
phase, MSHA will provide compliance assistance to startups. So 
far, MSHA has assisted 93 new or reopening mines with 
regulatory compliance, helping them to avoid thousands in fines 
and more swiftly commence their operations. How better to 
ensure safety than to help a new mine prepare for regulatory 
compliance before MSHA shows up unannounced for that mine's 
first statutorily mandated inspection?
    From an organizational efficiency perspective, it means 
situating our resources strategically to accommodate future 
growth. The majority of critical mineral mines in development 
fall west of the Mississippi and MSHA needs to be resourced 
accordingly into the future. Again, I appreciate the 
opportunity to discuss mine safety and health with you. I look 
forward to answering any questions that members of this 
Subcommittee may have.
    [The prepared statement of Mr. Palmer follows:]
    [GRAPHICS NOT AVAILABLE IN TIFF FORMAT]     

    Chairman Mackenzie. Thank you, Mr. Palmer. Under Committee 
Rule 9, we will now ask questions of the witnesses under the 5-
minute rule. We will recognize the Chairman of the full 
Committee, Mr. Walberg and then we will move to recess and 
reconvene after House voting. With that, I turn to Mr. Walberg.
    Mr. Walberg. Well, thank you Mr. Chairman, and thank you 
Mr. Palmer for being here. I remember when I Chaired this 
Subcommittee a number of years ago and the opportunities to go 
down into underground mines in West Virginia, Pennsylvania, 
open pit, surface mining out in North Dakota, salt mine under 
Detroit and then up in the Upper Peninsula of Michigan to see 
some of the hard rock mines that that went on.
    What a valuable resource and endeavor we have and the 
miners, incredible people willing to do things that most do not 
think about. As well as the mine operators, providing the 
resources that we need. Thank you for your attention to all of 
this. MSHA's mission is to promote safe and helpful workplaces 
for America's miners, and that demands that robust, compliance 
assistance efforts accompany the agency's enforcement status.
    Can you discuss the agency's compliance assistance and 
safety and health or the CASH program with us?
    Mr. Palmer. Thank you, Mr. Chairman for that question. The 
CASH program was established last year. It stands for 
Compliance Assistance in Safety and Health, and it is one of a 
handful of different abilities that--capabilities that MSHA has 
to provide compliance assistance.
    The CASH program itself is focused mostly on the startups 
that I was referring to in my testimony. Again, most of those 
tend to be west of the Mississippi. When a mine is in 
development, our compliance assistance specialist under this 
CASH program will establish contact with them. Now if the mine 
is still in early development and they have not begun to 
construct the mine, build roads, build buildings, begin to move 
earth, they may not be ready for a compliance assistance visit.
    We are establishing those relationships, and when they are 
ready we will send a specialist out to walk them through what 
is referred to as an EO1 inspection, the statutorily mandated 
twos and fours as we call them, and without issuing citations 
and violations. Then at some point, unexpectedly, unannounced, 
because under the Mine Act it would constitute advanced notice, 
which is prohibited, at some point an MSHA inspector 
subsequently will show up unannounced and do the full EO1 
inspection, including violations and citations.
    Again, as I said in my testimony, it is all in service of 
preparing them to comply, and educating them on how this works, 
especially if the mine operator, the company is headquartered 
based in a different country where they have a different system 
for mine safety and they are not familiar with the Mine Act, 
the MINER Act and 30 C.F.R.
    Mr. Walberg. Well that side of the ledger is so important, 
to have clear understanding. The enforcement aspect always has 
to be there, right? It has to be done in such a way that as a 
partnership in the process. I appreciate that. We can all agree 
that vast majority of mine operators want to do the right 
thing. It costs them significantly if they do not.
    They want to take care of their workers and they want to 
provide them with a safe and healthful workplace. In addition 
to the CASH program, what are you planning to do at MSHA to 
promote more outreach to all stakeholders and ensure their 
views are considered?
    Mr. Palmer. Yes. Thank you for that question, Mr. Chairman. 
I intend, as Assistant Secretary, to be as visible, engaged and 
responsive as possible with the industry, the stakeholders. 
Serving as Deputy Assistant Secretary during the first Trump 
administration, I spent a great deal of time attending safety 
conferences and speaking, and just getting to know the 
operators.
    I believe that having those relationships goes a long way 
toward helping them to comply and keep their mine safe. I am 
also looking to renew these formal alliance agreements that 
MSHA has had in place since the year 2000 with numerous trade 
associations in the mining industry, and they are non-binding. 
They are more aspirational, but they do commit, softly commit, 
again non-binding, the two parties, MSHA and the trade 
association that is party to the agreement, to convening at 
least twice a year in service of safety, to cover really 
important safety topics and trends in mine safety. I intend to 
be fully engaged with the industry along the way.
    Mr. Walberg. Well, I applaud you for your more than 20,000 
inspections of 12,000 mines during the course of 2025, and do 
not have time to ask you about the plans for 2026. I assume you 
will be aggressive as well and help us in the whole mining 
situation. I see my time has expired. I yield back.
    Chairman Mackenzie. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. A vote has 
been called in the House and pursuant to the previous order, 
the Chair declares the Committee in recess, subject to the call 
of the Chair. We will plan to reconvene promptly 10 minutes 
after the last votes in this series have been called. With 
that, the Committee now stands in recess.
    [Recess.]
    Chairman Mackenzie. Appreciate everybody's patience as the 
House was conducting voting. We will now reconvene our hearing 
today, and we are going to go back to member questioning for 
the witness. With that, I will recognize our Ranking Member for 
5 minutes of questioning.
    Ms. Omar. Thank you, Chairman. Assistant Secretary Palmer, 
I want a clear record on your past history with respect to the 
silica rule. You were previously the Executive Vice President 
of Essential Minerals Association, a trade association of 
mining companies; is that correct?
    Mr. Palmer. That is correct.
    Ms. Omar. Did EMA comment on the proposed rule?
    Mr. Palmer. Yes, EMA did.
    Ms. Omar. Please detail your participation in those 
comments.
    Mr. Palmer. As executive vice President, I oversaw the 
Safety and Health Committee, which is composed of the 
industrial hygienists and safety managers from all the member 
companies.
    Ms. Omar. Did you personally review, edit, approve or 
direct any part of those comments?
    Mr. Palmer. Those comments were the product of a consensus 
from--that flowed from all of those member companies.
    Ms. Omar. Did you have a direct contact with those comments 
before they were submitted?
    Mr. Palmer. I participated in that process. Our President--
--
    Ms. Omar. Okay. What was the core objection to the rule by 
the Essential Mineral Association?
    Mr. Palmer. Well Congresswoman, because the silica rule is 
currently subject to ongoing litigation and rulemaking, I 
cannot comment in any detail at this time.
    Ms. Omar. That is true because your previous employer, 
Essential Minerals, is also party to the litigation on the 8th 
Circuit seeking to vacate the silica rule; is that correct?
    Mr. Palmer. That is not correct, Congresswoman. They are 
not party to that coalition that challenged to the rule.
    Ms. Omar. They are not?
    Mr. Palmer. They are not.
    Ms. Omar. Okay. Exactly what role did you play in 
developing the EMA's position and regulatory agenda in this 
case?
    Mr. Palmer. I have already described the role that I 
performed. Again, because that rule is subject to ongoing 
litigation and rulemaking, I cannot comment in detail.
    Ms. Omar. Okay. Well, given your past activities related to 
the silica rule, have you recused yourself from matters related 
to this rule? Yes or no?
    Mr. Palmer. I follow all recusal directions from the 
designated agency ethics officer at the Department of Labor.
    Ms. Omar. Is that a yes or a no?
    Mr. Palmer. I follow all recusals that the designated 
agency----
    Ms. Omar. It is not that hard, sir, for you to say you have 
recused yourself or you have not.
    Mr. Palmer. I do not recuse myself. It is that the 
designated agency ethics officer directs me to recuse myself 
from certain matters, and I adhere to that strictly.
    Ms. Omar. Okay. I appreciate you finally responding to 
Committee Democrats' oversight letter from last year on the 
agencies concerning decisions to proceed with multiple office 
closures. I want to focus on one decision in particular, which 
is your plan to close the District 12 office in Pineville, West 
Virginia. Are you aware of the history behind the creation of 
that office?
    Mr. Palmer. Thank you for that question. I was not sworn in 
until October 23d of last year, so I did not participate in 
that process. I appreciate the opportunity to clarify. In your 
opening statement, you suggested that dozens of offices closed 
when in fact it was only six, one of which was----
    Ms. Omar. Well, I am asking about a particular one, so let 
me remind you. District 12 was created after the Upper Big 
Branch mine disaster in 2010, an explosion that killed 29 
miners. After this entirely preventable tragedy, MSHA 
recognized it needed to do more to protect miners.
    It created District 12 to split an overwhelmed district's 
workload and strengthen oversight capacity in Southern West 
Virginia. Mr. Palmer, tell us plainly what you are going to do 
with District 12?
    Mr. Palmer. Congresswoman, there were no terminations of 
inspectors in that process, as I understand it, that occurred 
last year with the closure of those, all six of those offices. 
The inspectors who inspected mines are inspecting the same 
mines going forward. There is--we have the same number of 
inspectors in that region as we did before.
    Ms. Omar. Seems from your response that you are relocating 
the offices or reassigning folks. What steps have you taken to 
ensure the same problems uncovered in the after-action review 
of Upper Big Branch will not happen again after the offices 
have been closed?
    Mr. Palmer. The Labor Department made exceptions last year, 
due to MSHA's safety and health enforcement mission. No 
inspectors were terminated, including those who were in their 
probationary period. The Department also did not allow 
inspectors to opt into the second round of the designated, I am 
sorry, deferred resignation program. We will be able to 
complete all of our statutorily required inspections this 
fiscal year, just as we did last year, including in the region 
you are referring to.
    Ms. Omar. I yield.
    Chairman Mackenzie. Thank you. Next I will yield to myself 
for 5 minutes of questioning and I want to discuss, Mr. Palmer, 
the Trump administration's policies have gone a long way to 
encourage job growth, particularly in the mining industry, an 
area of focus of theirs. The President has issued an executive 
order focusing on growing our domestic critical mineral and 
coal production. Can you please explain how MSHA fits in with 
that agenda?
    Mr. Palmer. Yes. Thank you for that question Mr. Chairman, 
and I would be happy to. The administration has several 
different tracks where they are looking to incentivize more 
domestic mining, the reshoring of critical minerals, as I 
referred to earlier.
    One is FAST-41 status, where there are now 15 projects that 
have been assigned that status, which makes more efficient the 
permitting process for new mines. There are other efforts. I 
cannot speak to the detail of EPA. It is not part of the 
Department of Labor, but I know that EPA, in terms of the coal 
sector, has taken some actions as well. The granting or 
reviving the right-of-way to the Ambler Metals mine in Alaska 
is another example. There are all these different policies and 
actions that are leading to the opening of new mines, reopening 
of old mines and additional mining at current operations.
    MSHA's role in that is wherever mining occurs, whether it 
is new or preexisting, we are bound by the Mine Act to perform 
our EO1 inspections at least two times a year at surface mines, 
and at least four times a year at underground mines, and we 
will continue to do that. As I alluded to in my opening 
testimony, we do want to track where those new mines are 
reopening, and as I said so many of those new critical minerals 
mines are opening out west.
    I want to be sure as a Secretary that we are resourcing the 
agency so that we have the capabilities, the resources in those 
places as these new mines come online.
    Chairman Mackenzie. Well, thank you for that answer. As you 
are well aware, the expansion of critical minerals is an 
imperative for our country's national security. We have seen 
our adversaries try to use them as leverage against us, and so 
making sure that MSHA is keeping pace with that expansion is 
important in your role. I look forward to hearing from the 
administration about that expansion, but also how MSHA can 
continue to maintain worker safety as that expansion occurs.
    My next question relates to something you touched on 
already, so I do not know if there is any more to expand on, 
but there have been leaps in technology over the past decade 
that have been pretty astounding. Obviously, the introduction 
of more AI capable technology. You mentioned drones. Can you 
just discuss how advancements are changing the mining industry 
and then also what that means for enforcement of laws under 
your jurisdiction?
    Mr. Palmer. Right. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, for that 
question. To me, the most exciting opportunity is through 
artificial intelligence, right? Mine operators themselves are 
looking to adopt it, but at MSHA, as I said in my opening 
testimony, we are working on predictive analytics.
    Taking decades and decades of very granular data that our 
inspectors have collected and deposited into our data base, 
using predictive analytics, we are developing dashboards. Some 
of those dashboards are intended for internal use and some are 
for external use. For internal use, when an inspector goes to a 
mine in the future, they will not just simply have a checklist 
of things that they need to look at as an inspector, but the 
predictive analytics will suggest to them that there are 
certain aspects of that mine that they need to pay particular 
attention to.
    In terms of external uses of these dashboards, ideally at 
some point we anticipate that a mine operator will be able to 
go on our website, log in with their credentials and look at a 
dashboard that predicts for their specific mine based on their 
inspection history, violation, citations, but broader metrics 
as well like the type of material mine, the region, the 
climate, the size of the mine.
    They will be able to look at predictive analytics pointing 
them to the most likely hazards that would occur in their mine. 
If you are a mine operator, this will be extremely valuable in 
terms of focusing their internal safety protocols on the places 
where an accident, an injury is most likely to occur. I am 
especially excited about the artificial intelligence 
capabilities we are developing.
    Chairman Mackenzie. Great. Well, thank you for your 
response there. I do have some other questions about silica, 
which I think members on both sides are going to be asking 
about, which is a good topic that we consider moving forward, 
and also about training of our miners and what we can do to 
encourage training in that space. With that, I will turn now 
next to Mr. Fine from Florida for his questions.
    Mr. Fine. Thank you Mr. Chairman, and thank you for being 
here today, Mr. Palmer. Obviously making sure that we can 
extract fossil fuels from our mines and other rare earth 
mineral safely is incredibly important for the national 
security of this country. We can live in a fictional world 
where we assume windmills and solar panels can make everything 
work, but those of us who live in the real world understand 
that that is not a sustainable strategy for the United States.
    I have a few questions. Certain parts of the Biden 
Administration's first rule on respirable silica align with the 
silica requirements of OSHA, but others do not. This can lead 
to confusion over what rules need to be followed. If, for 
example, a construction company is performing work at a mining 
facility under your leadership how do you envision MSHA working 
with OSHA to create more clarity and consistency between rules 
that may deal with similar hazards?
    Mr. Palmer. I appreciate that question, Congressman Fine. 
As I said earlier, I cannot comment at this time on the silica 
rule, in as much as it is pending in litigation and rulemaking. 
I can say this. The Assistant Secretary for OSHA, Dave Keeling 
and I were nominated on the same day, confirmed on the same 
day, sworn in at the same time, and we have a great now pre-
existing relationship.
    We do consider OSHA and MSHA to be sister agencies, and so 
on any number of rules or specific risks or hazards Dave and I 
talk all the time, and I look forward to collaborating with him 
routinely throughout our tenures. I appreciate that question.
    Mr. Fine. Well, thank you. I want to ask you since you are 
new, I would like to ask you about any challenges you have 
encountered as you begin your tenure at MSHA and set 
priorities. Were there any impediments from the Biden 
administration that hindered the agency? If so, what were those 
impediments?
    Mr. Palmer. Well I appreciate that question, Congressman. 
There is one thing that I will highlight. Back in 2021, the 
Biden administration promulgated an executive order requiring 
all agencies to further diversify their workforce. At MSHA, 
what that meant was something called the Bridge program that 
the Biden administration at MSHA created.
    They dispensed with the requirements that were--that are in 
five preexisting laws going back to the Coal Mine Safety Act of 
1941, and including the Mine Act of 1977, requiring MSHA to 
hire as new inspectors those with 5 years or more of mining 
experience. They dispensed with that and created what they 
called this Bridge program.
    Well, they hired 54 such individuals and I am pleased to 
say that 21 of them graduated, so to speak, to become full-
blown inspectors performing the EO1 inspections I have been 
referring to. Unfortunately though, 33 of them did not. That is 
what, a 61 percent, dropout or attrition rate and were it not 
for that, that ill-conceived program where they hired 
individuals with no mining experience, we would have 
potentially 33 more inspectors to perform our inspections, 
which would relieve some of the pressure on the rest of the 
inspector.
    Mr. Fine. Right. You are saying, so I understand, that the 
Biden administration put hiring unqualified DEI hires ahead of 
making sure miners were safe?
    Mr. Palmer. You could view it that way, Congressman.
    Mr. Fine. Okay. Miners being killed is less important than 
having unqualified DEI hires?
    Mr. Palmer. Well as I say, they dispensed with that 
requirement that is in five separate laws going dating back to 
1941. I will say that during the first Trump term when we 
hired, we did require the preexisting experience, the 
prerequisite.
    Mr. Fine. Other than sacrificing miners' lives on the altar 
of DEI, are there any other internal policies still lingering 
from the Biden administration that you intend to address?
    Mr. Palmer. Congressman, no. Nothing comes to mind apart 
from that.
    Mr. Fine. Well, I certainly appreciate you getting rid of 
that stupid policy and so I yield back, Mr. Chairman.
    Chairman Mackenzie. Thank you. Next we will go to Ranking 
Member of the Full Committee, Mr. Scott.
    Mr. Scott. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. 
Secretary, there is a thing called impact inspections are 
important because they complement the mandatory twice-a-year 
and four-a-year inspections. They are important because they 
target mines with significant compliance issues for additional 
inspections. The CNN has reported a 75 percent decrease in 
impact inspections for the first half of 2025, compared to the 
same period in 2024. How many impact inspections did MSHA 
complete in total for 2025?
    Mr. Palmer. Congressman, I appreciate the question. I do 
not have that number close at hand. I will say that we have 
continued what we call targeted inspections. I think it is 
really a question of nomenclature that are akin to the impact 
inspections. I do not have that number offhand, but I could get 
that for you as followup if you, if you would like.
    Mr. Scott. Has the number of these--why did the number of 
impact inspections fall so precipitously?
    Mr. Palmer. Again, Congressman, I do not have that number 
close in hand. We continue to do what we call targeted 
inspections, which are, are akin to the--what used to be called 
impact inspections.
    Mr. Scott. Could you get the number of those that you have 
performed?
    Mr. Palmer. Yep, sure. I can followup with that. I would be 
happy to.
    Mr. Scott. Your testimony does not mention impact 
inspections. If you could kind of talk about that and what you 
intend to do going forward? Since 2010, MSHA publicly posted 
notices and results of these kinds of inspections, but the 
agency appears to have stopped sharing that information 
publicly. Is that true?
    Mr. Palmer. To the best of my knowledge, we do not publish 
those under the current administration.
    Mr. Scott. Why is that?
    Mr. Palmer. Congressman, I will be happy to look into that. 
I believe that that predates my confirmation and swearing in 
last year. I believe they were terminated last year. I will 
check into that for you.
    Mr. Scott. Okay. The Silica Enforcement Initiative that was 
launched in 2022 targets mines with dangerous levels of silica 
dust. Is MSHA continuing to implement that Initiative?
    Mr. Palmer. Congressman as I said earlier, because the 
silica rule is subject to ongoing litigation and rulemaking, I 
cannot comment further at this time.
    Mr. Scott. Well, that is an initiative. That is not a rule.
    Mr. Palmer. We continue to inspect mines as we have 
previously, including sampling for dust, including silica, if 
that is what you are asking. Yes. We have not suspended our 
normal inspection protocols.
    Mr. Scott. Well, do you know how many mines were inspected 
under the Silica Enforcement Initiative in 2025?
    Mr. Palmer. I do not have the number close at hand, but I 
can get that for you as well.
    Mr. Scott. Okay. The incidents of progressive massive 
fibrosis, PMF, is apparently increasing and is a higher 
proportion of black lung benefit claims. Why is that?
    Mr. Palmer. Well Congressman, Black Lung Benefits Act falls 
under the jurisdiction of the Office of Worker Compensation 
Policy within the Department of Labor. MSHA has no role in 
black lung benefits and implementing that law.
    Mr. Scott. Right. You have a role in preventing black lung 
disease?
    Mr. Palmer. Oh, sure. If that is your question Congressman, 
the coal dust rule is still fully in effect. We continue to 
sample for that type of dust, and if there is any concern there 
on my part, it is that I want to make sure that mine operators 
have continue to have access to the CPDMs, the Continuous 
Personal Dust Monitors. There is only one manufacturer, as you 
may know. They submitted a new model for testing and 
certification to MSHA.
    Our role in that process is to test for permissibility in 
underground coal mines. Now NIOSH has the responsibility for 
testing for performance to ensure that the device performs as 
designed and as it is claimed. I am in routine contact with 
NIOSH's senior leadership, as you may have seen. I believe it 
was last week. They got the go-ahead to rehire staff for the 
division that performs that testing.
    Dr. John Howard, who heads NIOSH as you know, he and I 
together want to make sure that, assuming this new device does, 
you know, it gets tested and certified and passes the tests, 
that it is available to the mine operators.
    Mr. Scott. Can you comment on whether or not the staffing 
levels are sufficient to fulfill your responsibilities, and 
whether or not the closures of field offices have had an 
adverse effect on your ability to get your job done?
    Mr. Palmer. Congressman, we completed, as Chairman Walberg 
said earlier, all of our statutorily mandated inspections in 
Fiscal Year 1925. We have the ability to do likewise in Fiscal 
Year 2026.
    Every year, and this dates back at least to the first Trump 
term, every year we do some overtime. We have inspectors travel 
from different locations to help out other districts to make 
sure that those districts can fulfill their inspections. It 
does require overtime, which is cost. It requires travel, which 
is cost, and it does put more of a burden on some of our 
inspectors to do that--those additional inspections. We have 
the ability to fulfill that obligation this fiscal year.
    Mr. Scott. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
    Chairman Mackenzie. Thank you. Next, we will turn to Mr. 
Messmer from Indiana.
    Mr. Messmer. Thank you Mr. Chairman, and thank you Mr. 
Palmer for being here today. Coal mining is an important part 
of my home district, where we account for all active coal mines 
in the State of Indiana. My constituents feel it deeply when 
onerous Federal restrictions shutter coal mines across the 
State, raising our energy bills and taking away critical jobs 
from Hoosiers.
    In December, the Trump administration ordered a temporary 
halt to the plant shutdowns of two coal burning power plants in 
Indiana. This announcement in President Trump's executive order 
to reinvigorate America's clean coal industry, are examples of 
his administration's commitment to lowering Americans' cost of 
living and restoring U.S. global energy dominance.
    Mr. Palmer, can you tell us just how important domestic 
coal mining is to the United States?
    Mr. Palmer. Thank you for that question, Congressman. It is 
extremely important, which is why the administration 
promulgated executive orders last year and has taken other 
actions to help reinvigorate the American coal industry. I mean 
when the average American thinks about coal, they think of, I 
think, one thing, which is power generation.
    There are different types of coal used for different 
purposes. The two main ones, of course, are thermal coal for 
power generation, but then there is also metallurgical coal, 
which is used in steelmaking. There is also anthracite coal, 
which my ancestors mined in northeast Pennsylvania in prior 
generations. That is used in the electric arc furnace 
steelmaking, green steelmaking as it is called, and that too is 
a potential source for critical minerals and rare earth 
elements.
    Between the first Trump term and my current tenure, I 
participated in something called CORE-CM, which was a 
department--is still a Department of Energy program for 
researching ways to extract critical minerals and rare earth 
elements from coal and anthracite. Some coal out in the Powder 
River Basin contain a lot of such minerals and elements, from 
coal, from mine tailings, from slag, from the metal smelting 
process, fly ash, all sorts of waste materials, acid mine 
drainage.
    Coal is not just, you know, one monolithic commodity that 
is used for electricity generation. It is important to us for a 
lot of different reasons and a potential source for some of the 
critical minerals that the President's trying to reshore back 
into the United States. I appreciate that question.
    Mr. Messmer. Thank you. In order to keep up with the 
demands of the coal industry, we must ensure that the health 
and safety of miners is a top priority. However, the Biden era 
one-size-fits-all rules like the silica rule, currently being 
litigated, are not a solution. I appreciate your response to my 
letter and other members of this Committee, asking for MSHA to 
consider amending the silica rule and confirming your 
administration's goal of working with mining operators.
    MSHA has a history of providing compliance guidance on 
final rules, so employers know how regulations--know the 
regulations on how to protect their employees. Do you expect to 
issue a compliance document along with any final rules?
    Mr. Palmer. Absolutely, Congressman. With any final rule, 
depending on the magnitude of the rule, we will at least issue 
guidance documents. In many cases, we will hold public meetings 
across the country, where operators can come and in person hear 
from MSHA's Enforcement, our Technical Support Group, all the 
subject matter experts on how to comply with that given rule. 
Yes, absolutely. We want to be as forthcoming as possible in 
helping operators comply with any rule that we might 
promulgate.
    Mr. Messmer. Thank you. Will MSHA also ensure that 
inspectors are fully briefed on these guidance documents, so 
they are well-equipped to help employers protect their 
employees?
    Mr. Palmer. Absolutely, Congressman. As you probably know, 
we have the Mine Health and Safety Academy in Beckley, West 
Virginia, and that's where we do our training. It is not just 
for entry level inspectors and such. We have all sorts of 
training down there, and that is where we would typically 
educate our--and a lot of it is virtual as well--educate our 
inspectorate in terms of any given new rule on how it works and 
how to help the operators to comply with that rule.
    Mr. Messmer. Okay. Well, thank you. I appreciate your 
responses, and I yield back the remainder of my time.
    Chairman Mackenzie. Thank you. Next we will go to Mr. 
Grothman from Wisconsin.
    Mr. Grothman. Thank you. I think a lot of people, when you 
first bring up mining and this coal mining, are immediately 
reminded of a comment of a person running for presidency in 
this country. We are going to put a lot of coal miners and coal 
companies out of business. Do you remember that quote? It was 
kind of well publicized at the time.
    Mr. Palmer. I do, Congressman.
    Mr. Grothman. Yes. The thing that scares me about it is she 
represented a lot of people who apparently are just 
instinctively anti-coal. Do you feel within your agency that 
mindset exists among any of the regulators or anybody that puts 
together regulations? Do you see that of some of the people you 
work with?
    Mr. Palmer. No, Congressman, I do not. I, during the first 
term serving as Deputy Assistant Secretary, developed great 
relationships with our career staff. Those carry over into this 
administration. They are extremely professional. We have some 
of the best subject matter experts on all sorts of aspects of 
mining, roof control, ventilation control, mine rescue, the 
construction of impoundments, dams and things.
    No. I enjoy working with them. I have great relationships 
with them, and so I actually do not see that as an impediment.
    Mr. Grothman. I am glad to hear it. Could you comment a 
little bit about what you think the role of coal is in future 
American energy policy? Do we have the ability to expand the 
use of coal over say what it's been the last 10 years?
    Mr. Palmer. Well Congressman, the potential for future 
additional coal mining depends on policies across a lot of 
different agencies. From MSHA's perspective, it really is a 
matter of responding where through whatever policies and 
actions the administration takes, to the degree that there is 
additional coal mining then we must respond and make sure we 
are inspecting,
    Mr. Grothman. I guess I will put it this way. Do you feel 
we are in a position that if on a national level or a State 
level, they are going to build more coal-fired plants, that we 
have the ability to extract more coal out of the coal mines and 
do it safely?
    Mr. Palmer. Oh, we do have the ability to extract more 
coal. The deposits exist, the technology exists, the operators 
are there. As long as it is profitable, they will. Yes, I am 
confident that MSHA has the staffing, the expertise and the 
will to every fiscal year, fulfill our statutory obligations 
under the Mine Act. Yes, absolutely. I am confident of that.
    Mr. Grothman. Okay. I want to flag for you an issue related 
to EPA's Integrated Risk Information System assessments. Okay. 
I know IRIS falls squarely under the EPA's guidance, but I am 
concerned about its impact on the mining operations in 
Wisconsin, and you are familiar we have some mines in 
Wisconsin.
    The IRIS assessment failed to address unresolved concerns 
before the final version was released. As the result, it raises 
questions about its scientific credibility. The contents of 
this assessment and the resulting actions from it could have an 
impact on Wisconsin miners. Can you commit to working with my 
staff and our local stakeholders, to understand how this issue 
could impact continuing investment or job retention in 
Wisconsin?
    Mr. Palmer. I do, Congressman. I am not intimately familiar 
with the IRIS study, but I understand it pertains to arsenic 
and in terms of mine safety and health, if at a mine, a given 
mine, there is possibly the possibility of an overexposure to 
arsenic, we would send our specialists, our industrial 
hygienists out to collect a sample, put it through the lab and 
if they identify an overexposure, they would go out and assist 
the mine with remediation.
    I will say that there hasn't been an overexposure of 
arsenic in MSHA's records for at least the last 35 years. At 
this point, it does not appear to be a hazard in the mines. I 
do commit to working with your staff on this issue.
    Mr. Grothman. Thanks. Your written testimony illustrates 
ways you seek to modernize MSHA, including modernizing agency 
regulations. Could you share with us policies that you are 
considering for potential regulatory or deregulatory action?
    Mr. Palmer. Oh yes, Congressman. It predates my tenure, but 
last year, early last year, the President signed--issued three 
executive orders that collectively required certain agencies 
to, a lot of agencies to promulgate deregulatory initiatives. 
Again, that predates me, but between June and July of last 
year, MSHA did publish 19 different regulatory items that all 
of which are classified as deregulatory.
    Those are still in the pipeline. We will continue on those 
19 initiatives, and in doing so, I pledge to fully adhere to 
the Administrative Procedure Act of 1946, which lays out that 
process. That process includes a period of certain duration, 
30, 60, 90 days whatever, where there is a public comment 
period, and any stakeholder can submit a comment to the record.
    Then once that comment period ends, the agency is obligated 
to analyze all of those comments and reflect those comments in 
the final rule. Those 19 deregulatory items are still in the 
pipeline. I cannot comment on details because they are ongoing 
rulemaking, but I can tell you that they are continuing 
forward.
    Mr. Grothman. Well thank you, Mr. Assistant Secretary. I am 
glad you came over here today, and you are exactly the type of 
person we need over there to be a fair broker when it comes to 
mining.
    Mr. Palmer. Well thank you, sir.
    Chairman Mackenzie. Thank you. Our final set of questions 
come from Mr. Moylan of Guam.
    Mr. Moylan. Mr. Chairman and Ranking Member, thank you for 
allowing me to waive onto the Subcommittee today and it is good 
to be back.
    Mr. Palmer, thanks for coming today and I want to say 
congratulations on your confirmation and thank you again for 
the work you did with me and my team while you were Senior 
Advisor for congressional Affairs. Thank you so much, and I am 
looking forward to working with you in your new position as 
well.
    Mr. Palmer, in 2024 a report from the Department of Labor 
Office of the Inspector General found that MSHA failed to 
sufficiently identify its own jurisdictions and had never 
conducted mandatory mine inspections in three U.S. Pacific 
territories. How are you making sure MSHA completes these 
inspections and fulfills its mandates?
    Mr. Palmer. Thank you, Congressman, for that question. I am 
familiar with that November 2024 memo to the Biden 
administration, and I can tell you this, that so last year, 
MSHA sent an inspector to all three of the territories in the 
Pacific to inventory the mines that are there.
    They inventoried 17 mines, and subsequently senior 
officials I know met with your office and offices for the other 
two territories. As I sit here today, our head of Enforcement 
and our Assistant District Manager from our Birmingham, Alabama 
office are in the territories. They are meeting with government 
officials and mine operators to talk about the process going 
forward.
    Next week, we are sending inspectors over and they are 
going to perform compliance assistance visits. These are the 
first inspections for your mines, they are going to go out and 
walk each mine through an EO1 full statutory inspection, but 
without issuing any citations or violations. At some point in 
the future, they will return and perform one of the actual EO1 
inspections, and it will be the real inspection with actual 
violations and citations.
    The whole idea again is to orient your mine operators and 
make sure they understand how the process works, so that when 
MSHA shows up unannounced, they will be prepared to get through 
an inspection, hopefully with very few citations and 
violations.
    Mr. Moylan. That is very helpful taking that approach. I 
would like to work with you on this, so we can help the island 
better understand what we need for the safeguard and the 
protection of the community, and what we need for our Nation as 
well.
    Mr. Palmer. Absolutely Congressman, and if you have any 
feedback that you get back home, please do share that with us 
for better or for worse, because we want to make sure this 
occurs as efficiently and effectively as possible. Thank you 
for that.
    Mr. Moylan. You are welcome. Just one other question. Now 
when many people think about the mining industry and miners, 
they think about coal mining. Coal mining is just the tip of 
the iceberg compared to metal/non-metal mines and a variety of 
above ground mining operations. How are you taking a different 
approach to strategies for protecting miners in different 
sectors of the industry? What factors are you taking into 
account as you develop these strategies?
    Mr. Palmer. Yes. Thank you for that followup question. Back 
during the first Trump administration, the Assistant Secretary 
Dave Zatezalo, I think you could call it his signal 
achievement, was creating something called One MSHA, where 
previously within the Enforcement Division, there were two 
separate verticals.
    One was for coal safety and health, the other was for 
metal/non-metal. You are right. For every coal mine, there are 
a dozen metal/non-metal mines. To your point on surface versus 
underground, for every underground mine there are two dozen, 24 
surface mines. I will give you a good example pertaining to 
your territory.
    As I mentioned that the Assistant District Manager from the 
Birmingham, Alabama office is with our head of Enforcement in 
the territories right now. Well the reason he is there is 
because the inspectors we are going to send to do those 
compliance assistance visits and the subsequent full 
inspections are from our Puerto Rico office.
    They are most familiar with the most expert in the types of 
mines, all surface mines in the territories, right, that you 
have in your territories. We are sending the ones who are most 
expert. It is a situational thing. It is tailoring our 
inspections or compliance assistance visits to the type of 
mine. Yes, surface mines are quite different than underground 
mines, and we want to acknowledge that even though now the 
Enforcement Division is one, you know, unified unit.
    Mr. Moylan. Thank you for the explanation. Welcome aboard. 
Looking forward to working with you.
    Mr. Palmer. Well, thank you.
    Mr. Moylan. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
    Chairman Mackenzie. Thank you. That concludes questioning, 
and we will now move to closing remarks. I would like to 
recognize the Ranking Member for her closing statement.
    Ms. Omar. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Once again, thank you 
Assistant Secretary Palmer for joining us today. The important 
of the Mine Safety and Health Administration's role as 
protecting the lives of miners cannot be overstated. Black lung 
disease caused by inhalation of coal and silica dust is 
increasingly affecting younger and younger miners.
    The Biden administration saw this as an imminent danger and 
took steps to protect miners from silica exposure through 
common sense safety standards. Unfortunately, instead of 
enforcing the Biden era rule, the Trump administration has 
given mining executives a pass to put miners in harm's way, 
without proper protection against silica exposure.
    The administration's chaotic firing of staff at MSHA and 
NIOSH, its efforts to close dozens of regional MSHA offices, 
have undermined decades of work preventing black lung, avoiding 
workplace disasters and saving workers' lives. MSHA's work 
quite literally can mean life or death for tens of thousands of 
miners.
    That is why Congress must take action to hold MSHA 
accountable and ensure its enforcement well-researched safety 
regulations and conducts regulatory inspections, because miners 
deserve to come home at the end of the day safe, healthy and 
well paid.
    Thank you once again for joining us today, Assistant 
Secretary Palmer. I look forward to continuing our conversation 
and discussing more ways that we can keep miners safe on the 
job.
    I would like to request unanimous consent to enter into the 
record a regulatory timeline of MSHA's silica standards, a 
timeline outlining decades of expert recommendations on this 
respirable crystalline silica, a letter from the National 
Coalition of Black Lung and Respiratory Disease Clinics, and a 
letter from Appalachian Citizens Law Center and Appalachian 
Voices.
    Chairman Mackenzie. Without objection.
    [The letters of Ranking Member Omar follows:]
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    Ms. Omar. Thank you, and I yield back.
    Chairman Mackenzie. Thank you, Mr. Assistant Secretary for 
joining us today. Your testimony has been very helpful for 
those of us members of the Committee, and we appreciate you 
sharing your vision for how MSHA can achieve its goal of 
keeping America's miners safe and healthy.
    With advancements in technology and this administration's 
emphasis on domestic resource production and energy security, 
we are very likely at a hinge moment in this industry, and we 
look forward to seeing mining thrive once again all across our 
country, to help not only our economy but also national 
security. By promoting a strong safety culture, MSHA helps 
mines operate more reliably, protects workers' rights and 
reinforces public trust in the mining industry.
    We support your efforts as you strive to keep miners safe 
and productive. Again, I would like to thank you for joining us 
here today. It has been over 6 years since an Assistant 
Secretary of MSHA has come before the Committee, and it is an 
important part of our work on the Workforce Protection 
Subcommittee.
    I would like to thank you again and without objection, 
there being no further business before the Committee, this 
Subcommittee stands adjourned.
    Mr. Palmer. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
    [Whereupon, at 12:12 p.m., the hearing was adjourned.]
    [Questions and responses submitted for the record by Mr. 
Wayne Palmer follows:]
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